New rules on resident foreign assets reporting

[Janet]

The only one I can think of is Diana McGlone ... we don't have an e-cert ourselves. Her phones are 647 057 599 or 922 86 74 78. Good luck!!

[Nova]

Thanks Janet, I just phoned her, but she can't do it.  She would have needed two days advance to get authorized by me at the tax office.  I think I might be screwed....



Much later edit: It looks like my beloved friend, in her awesomeness, may have found me a solution...   

[Myrtle Hogan-Lance]

Ours are done.  Whew. 

We were at the financial adviser's office for about an hour this afternoon, with all three of us reviewing every input and the upload of the declaration.  When we went to leave after 2.00 I asked him how many more he had to do by the end of the day.  Answer:  10.  And he's got some really complicated ones where people have stock shares.  (Ours were about as simple as could be.)  So I figure 10 clients, 10 hours to the deadline, he's not gonna make it.  But ours are done. 

This is probably the first time I am happy not to be rich.  Declaring all the assets of a rich person would be a nightmare.

[Nova]

Well done, Myrtle, mine is too 

Declaring all the assets of a rich person would be a nightmare.

Most of them don't bother, apparently... 

[Myrtle Hogan-Lance]

Wonder how the hell they get away with it.

From what you and we have been through on this one, I am willing to wager that less than half of the people eligible to file a declaration will have done so by midnight.  A stupid piece of legislation backed up by a stupid IT system surrounded by pages and pages of stupid interpretations financial advisors are expected to memorise and adhere to. 

[Nova]

Yep, I agree.  I bet a helluva lot of people who should declare still don't even know about it!  Still, more fines means more funds for a government in crisis.  I'm just glad they won't be fining me.  And I'm going to get the stupid digital certificate now for next time.

[Guanche]

If I had money I would be quite worried about this law. It's no doubt an EU inspired move and I can't help but wonder if it's opening, or partly opening a gate to allow the Spanish government to tax those asset some how, or include them in any future bail out. A bit like Cyprus? even thought the assets are not in Spain?

Is my paranoia showing

[Myrtle Hogan-Lance]

No, not at all.  Italy did this a few years back and they are taxing Italian citizens on the property they own here.  The precedent has been set.   Now what we wait to see is what the threshold is. 

[Nova]

I don't understand how Spain can impose tax on foreign assets within the EU without violating the double-taxation treaty.  For example, I don't pay tax on the rental income from my property in the UK because the 10p a month profit I make on it is below the minimum income threshold, below which UK tax is not payable.  However HMRC is fully aware that my property is rented and for how much, and if tax should become payable on it, it would become payable to HMRC and only HMRC*.  WTF does that have to do with Spain???  About as much as the IRPF I pay from my monthly salary here in Tenerife has to do with HMRC!!!

Once more than one EU country starts claiming tax on the same assets/income, we're all done for.

*Yes I know the modelo 720 is concerned only with ownership of the property and not rental income, but still...

[Myrtle Hogan-Lance]

All I can say in support of my assertion on the Italian tax on property owned here is that it was relayed by at least three Italians who were in my Spanish class when we had a discussion on asset reporting. 

I totally agree with what you say regarding double taxation but am sure they get away with it somehow. Maybe they assume a nominal rental on the property and levy accordingly?  Though come to think of it our financial adviser said that would be illegal in Spain.  So I don't know how they do it. 

My problem with this is that the time honoured notion of personal property is flying out the window.  And, I've already paid income tax on every penny I have as an asset, so do not see why I should be taxed again.  Asset taxes suck. 

What would happen to a German who owned property or bank accounts in the UK but lived in Spain with their Italian spouse who had property or bank accounts in France?  Would they get four countries trying to tax their assets?  Answer:  if they're that rich, they'll pay nothing.